Just curious...I mean obviously the right can't stand him but he's really let down progressives and his democratic base. If he compromises on the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy it will be the straw that breaks the camel's back. Obama has certainly been dealt a tough hand but he just caves on everything! Thoughts?
Does anybody still support Obama? (NRR)
- Thread starter crazypoprock
- Start date
What would lack of support mean? On a local level, I'd be more willing to back viable 3rd party candidates running for the house or even senate but I'm not about to vote against Obama in 2012.
mannybolone said:I'm not about to vote against Obama in 2012.
This is what I am talking about.
We (the left) can easily defeat Obama by running a candidate in the primary against him or a 3rd party candidate in the general.
I never supported the health care plan that passed, but...
It is the best health care plan we have and a huge accomplishment.
Nixon, Carter and Clinton all tried to get health care passed and couldn't.
It is easy to hate on the health care bill, but the fact that soon almost all Americans will finally have access to health care is a huge accomplishment.
There is a whole long list of his accomplishments, that are never talked about, or not liberal enough for many, but very important.
This is what I am talking about.
We (the left) can easily defeat Obama by running a candidate in the primary against him or a 3rd party candidate in the general.
I never supported the health care plan that passed, but...
It is the best health care plan we have and a huge accomplishment.
Nixon, Carter and Clinton all tried to get health care passed and couldn't.
It is easy to hate on the health care bill, but the fact that soon almost all Americans will finally have access to health care is a huge accomplishment.
There is a whole long list of his accomplishments, that are never talked about, or not liberal enough for many, but very important.
You guys can call President Obama "weak" and "soft," I'll call him "pragmatic."
He caved on the Bush-era tax cut to get tax cuts to the middle class AND extension of unemployment benefits AND 2% reduction in payroll taxes (which should be added stimulus). Also this deal with help procure support for the ratification of the START treaty, which is crucial from the defense perspective. The "line in the sand" bullshit would have gotten nothing.
BTW, hate to break it to you but there's no one out there that could seriously challenge Obama in the primaries.
He caved on the Bush-era tax cut to get tax cuts to the middle class AND extension of unemployment benefits AND 2% reduction in payroll taxes (which should be added stimulus). Also this deal with help procure support for the ratification of the START treaty, which is crucial from the defense perspective. The "line in the sand" bullshit would have gotten nothing.
BTW, hate to break it to you but there's no one out there that could seriously challenge Obama in the primaries.
phongone said:
BTW, hate to break it to you but there's no one out there that could seriously challenge Obama in the primaries.
Agreed. But a left-leaning third party candidate with enough clout could certainly swing things in key states. Again, I'm not down for that.
BTW, hate to break it to you but there's no one out there that could seriously challenge Obama in the primaries.
Agreed. But a left-leaning third party candidate with enough clout could certainly swing things in key states. Again, I'm not down for that.
phongone said: this deal with help procure support for the ratification of the START treaty
You sure about that? What suggests this will be true, especially after the lame duck session gets replaced by the GOP majority in the house?
Caving on tax cuts for the rich is not a great compromise to achieve unemployment extensions.
And so much for both party's supposed devotion to deficit management!
Wonder how the Tea Party will spin this.
You sure about that? What suggests this will be true, especially after the lame duck session gets replaced by the GOP majority in the house?
Caving on tax cuts for the rich is not a great compromise to achieve unemployment extensions.
And so much for both party's supposed devotion to deficit management!
Wonder how the Tea Party will spin this.
There's also talk of Bloomberg running which would make things interesting!
Sure Obama is stuck between a rock and a hard place but he has the bully pulpit and public opinion on his side...he really should stop offering olive branches to the republicans and start showing some spine...I mean do we really want to support him just because there's no other alternative? That's pretty weak.
Sure Obama is stuck between a rock and a hard place but he has the bully pulpit and public opinion on his side...he really should stop offering olive branches to the republicans and start showing some spine...I mean do we really want to support him just because there's no other alternative? That's pretty weak.
phongone said:You guys can call President Obama "weak" and "soft," I'll call him "pragmatic."
He caved on the Bush-era tax cut to get tax cuts to the middle class AND extension of unemployment benefits AND 2% reduction in payroll taxes (which should be added stimulus). Also this deal with help procure support for the ratification of the START treaty, which is crucial from the defense perspective. The "line in the sand" bullshit would have gotten nothing.
BTW, hate to break it to you but there's no one out there that could seriously challenge Obama in the primaries.
Not sure what you mean by serious.
Anyone who runs against him and damages his standing with his base will greatly increase the chances that he loses in November.
It's 2 years away. Who could do it? John Kerry? Chelsea Clinton? Russ Feingold, Ron Wyden?
If someone chooses to challenge Obama what they need to do is build a ground game in Iowa and one other early state. A 40% polling in Iowa would produce huge headlines and allow the candidate to continue.
It is not about beating Obama, it is about eroding away support from the people he needs most if he is to win a second term.
It's what RKennedy did to Johnson in 1968 and TKennedy did to Carter in 1980.
Politics.
He caved on the Bush-era tax cut to get tax cuts to the middle class AND extension of unemployment benefits AND 2% reduction in payroll taxes (which should be added stimulus). Also this deal with help procure support for the ratification of the START treaty, which is crucial from the defense perspective. The "line in the sand" bullshit would have gotten nothing.
BTW, hate to break it to you but there's no one out there that could seriously challenge Obama in the primaries.
Not sure what you mean by serious.
Anyone who runs against him and damages his standing with his base will greatly increase the chances that he loses in November.
It's 2 years away. Who could do it? John Kerry? Chelsea Clinton? Russ Feingold, Ron Wyden?
If someone chooses to challenge Obama what they need to do is build a ground game in Iowa and one other early state. A 40% polling in Iowa would produce huge headlines and allow the candidate to continue.
It is not about beating Obama, it is about eroding away support from the people he needs most if he is to win a second term.
It's what RKennedy did to Johnson in 1968 and TKennedy did to Carter in 1980.
Politics.
crazypoprock said:There's also talk of Bloomberg running which would make things interesting!
Sure Obama is stuck between a rock and a hard place but he has the bully pulpit and public opinion on his side...he really should stop offering olive branches to the republicans and start showing some spine...I mean do we really want to support him just because there's no other alternative? That's pretty weak.
Most people didn't vote for Obama. They voted for who they thought Obama was.
If you look at what has always done in his life and what he has always said, he is not interested in "showing some spine".
He is interested in getting stuff done. Even if it looks like the Health Care bill and not the single payer that everyone knows is better. The goal is to get it done. He is not offering olive branches, he is getting things done. Or at least trying.
Sure Obama is stuck between a rock and a hard place but he has the bully pulpit and public opinion on his side...he really should stop offering olive branches to the republicans and start showing some spine...I mean do we really want to support him just because there's no other alternative? That's pretty weak.
Most people didn't vote for Obama. They voted for who they thought Obama was.
If you look at what has always done in his life and what he has always said, he is not interested in "showing some spine".
He is interested in getting stuff done. Even if it looks like the Health Care bill and not the single payer that everyone knows is better. The goal is to get it done. He is not offering olive branches, he is getting things done. Or at least trying.
Guest
phongone said:You guys can call President Obama "weak" and "soft," I'll call him "pragmatic."
He caved on the Bush-era tax cut to get tax cuts to the middle class AND extension of unemployment benefits AND 2% reduction in payroll taxes (which should be added stimulus). Also this deal with help procure support for the ratification of the START treaty, which is crucial from the defense perspective. The "line in the sand" bullshit would have gotten nothing.
BTW, hate to break it to you but there's no one out there that could seriously challenge Obama in the primaries.
This seems about right.
People can be "disappointed" in Obama all they want, but I'm not sure what they were expecting. He doesn't have magical powers. Imagine that.
There isn't a single Republican out there who is even worth considering as an alternative as far as I'm concerned. That party has gone batshit crazy and will remain that way for a long time. I think it's at least 50/50 that Palin will be their nominee in 2012, and a party that could nominate a delusional, ignorant sociopath like her just has no business running things.
He caved on the Bush-era tax cut to get tax cuts to the middle class AND extension of unemployment benefits AND 2% reduction in payroll taxes (which should be added stimulus). Also this deal with help procure support for the ratification of the START treaty, which is crucial from the defense perspective. The "line in the sand" bullshit would have gotten nothing.
BTW, hate to break it to you but there's no one out there that could seriously challenge Obama in the primaries.
This seems about right.
People can be "disappointed" in Obama all they want, but I'm not sure what they were expecting. He doesn't have magical powers. Imagine that.
There isn't a single Republican out there who is even worth considering as an alternative as far as I'm concerned. That party has gone batshit crazy and will remain that way for a long time. I think it's at least 50/50 that Palin will be their nominee in 2012, and a party that could nominate a delusional, ignorant sociopath like her just has no business running things.
crazypoprock said:There's also talk of Bloomberg running which would make things interesting!
Sure Obama is stuck between a rock and a hard place but he has the bully pulpit and public opinion on his side...he really should stop offering olive branches to the republicans and start showing some spine...I mean do we really want to support him just because there's no other alternative? That's pretty weak.
You know Bloomberg is a Republican right? Are you talking about a general election challenge?
So please school us on how he's going to pass his legislative agenda by being a tough, bad ass with a Republican-led house and a slim Democratic majority in the Senate.
Sure Obama is stuck between a rock and a hard place but he has the bully pulpit and public opinion on his side...he really should stop offering olive branches to the republicans and start showing some spine...I mean do we really want to support him just because there's no other alternative? That's pretty weak.
You know Bloomberg is a Republican right? Are you talking about a general election challenge?
So please school us on how he's going to pass his legislative agenda by being a tough, bad ass with a Republican-led house and a slim Democratic majority in the Senate.
phongone said:crazypoprock said:There's also talk of Bloomberg running which would make things interesting!
Sure Obama is stuck between a rock and a hard place but he has the bully pulpit and public opinion on his side...he really should stop offering olive branches to the republicans and start showing some spine...I mean do we really want to support him just because there's no other alternative? That's pretty weak.
You know Bloomberg is a Republican right? Are you talking about a general election challenge?
So please school us on how he's going to pass his legislative agenda by being a tough, bad ass with a Republican-led house and a slim Democratic majority in the Senate.
You are aware that he's been the mayor of the overwhelmingly Democratic New York City for close to a decade now right? He isn't your typical republican...and he would run as an independent. He has the spine and management skills that Obama lacks. I'm not saying I'd vote for him...I just think he could win.
Sure Obama is stuck between a rock and a hard place but he has the bully pulpit and public opinion on his side...he really should stop offering olive branches to the republicans and start showing some spine...I mean do we really want to support him just because there's no other alternative? That's pretty weak.
You know Bloomberg is a Republican right? Are you talking about a general election challenge?
So please school us on how he's going to pass his legislative agenda by being a tough, bad ass with a Republican-led house and a slim Democratic majority in the Senate.
You are aware that he's been the mayor of the overwhelmingly Democratic New York City for close to a decade now right? He isn't your typical republican...and he would run as an independent. He has the spine and management skills that Obama lacks. I'm not saying I'd vote for him...I just think he could win.
Guest
Obama is the best president we've had over the last 30 years. If you are a democrat and disagree, than please familiarize yourself with the fact that Obama does not control the universe. He can't immediately reverse the global economic downturn, the disparity between rich and poor, or the threat of terrorism. His beliefs are on the right (as in good) side of every democratic issue; if you are frustrated that he can't get legislation passed (as a moderate), how could you possibly say he is not "progressive" enough?
Also, just because the country was in better shape during prior presidencies doesn't say much about anything. If you let Carrot Top coach the 1992 Dream Team, they probably still would have won a gold.
How can you not be proud of Obama and what he stands for if you supported him in '08? What has changed?
I ride and will be volunteering/donating in '12.
Also, just because the country was in better shape during prior presidencies doesn't say much about anything. If you let Carrot Top coach the 1992 Dream Team, they probably still would have won a gold.
How can you not be proud of Obama and what he stands for if you supported him in '08? What has changed?
I ride and will be volunteering/donating in '12.
