So, if the construction trades are rife with gangsters, this should disqualify unions representing say health professionals, educators, retail workers etc?
Labor Unions? (NRR)
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So, if the construction trades are rife with gangsters, this should disqualify unions representing say health professionals, educators, retail workers etc?
So, if the construction trades are rife with gangsters, this should disqualify unions representing say health professionals, educators, retail workers etc?
Where did I say that? I didn't, so don't put words in my mouth.
Every word I said was true, and I never made any claims outside of what I directly experienced.
So, if the construction trades are rife with gangsters, this should disqualify unions representing say health professionals, educators, retail workers etc?
Where did I say that? I didn't, so don't put words in my mouth.
Every word I said was true, and I never made any claims outside of what I directly experienced.
In Australia the head of the Western Australian arm of the CFMEU (national construction industry) owns a hotel/pub in partnership with one of the heads of Multiplex (country's largest construction company).... but the memebrs kept voting him back in, even when he came out bragging about owning the hotel.
The current problem with unions is that they are not democratic enough. Furthermore, union leaders started to protect their own asses over the protection of their constituency.
To combat this, I propose:
1) All officials must be elected.
2) All elected officials should be subjected to immediate recall.
3) Rotation of bureaucratic tasks to prevent an entrenched, self-serving bureaucracy.
4) No elected official to be paid more than the average worker.
Those four rules were expanded upon in Lenin's Transitionary Programme (if I remember the title correctly).
Furthermore, I'd like to hear someone quantify what they mean when they say "union leadership is corrupt." I'm not disagreeing, but I'd like you to share what this means to you. As someone who supports union and is quite left-wing, I am also against corruption, however, I don't believe it's an inherent aspect of unionization.
To combat this, I propose:
1) All officials must be elected.
2) All elected officials should be subjected to immediate recall.
3) Rotation of bureaucratic tasks to prevent an entrenched, self-serving bureaucracy.
4) No elected official to be paid more than the average worker.
Those four rules were expanded upon in Lenin's Transitionary Programme (if I remember the title correctly).
Furthermore, I'd like to hear someone quantify what they mean when they say "union leadership is corrupt." I'm not disagreeing, but I'd like you to share what this means to you. As someone who supports union and is quite left-wing, I am also against corruption, however, I don't believe it's an inherent aspect of unionization.
A few of these ideas have been implemented in one of Canada's largest unions, CUPW (Canadian Union of Postal Workers). Postal workers have some of the best jobs in Canada, with the best benefits. Their union is very democratic, powerful, and fair to the workers. There is also very little corruption (if any) in CUPW, which I believe is large-in-part due to their highly democratic structure.
This is not true in the USA.
Unions are so demonized in this country that any one aspiring to political office would avoid ever working for a union.
The only exception I can think of is Reagan who was once head of the Actors Guild but renounced all unions before running for public office and spent his time in office destroy unions.
This is not true in the USA.
Unions are so demonized in this country that any one aspiring to political office would avoid ever working for a union.
The only exception I can think of is Reagan who was once head of the Actors Guild but renounced all unions before running for public office and spent his time in office destroy unions.
The reason Joe Biden is VP (despite having low-level brain damage due to multiple strokes) is that he could deliver the union vote.
The union vote is a major force in U.S. politics, more so with the current administration than it has been in decades.
Hardly demonized.
In the USA only the unions in NYC are corrupt.
Places like Chicago and Phiily......Cleveland and Pittsburg.......Miami and Boston.....etc., etc........no corruption at all.
im feeling what everyone is saying. this is a good thread.
horse...thats pretty impressive that you were in charge of projects like that and now youre running a record shop. no dis at all, i loev the career switcheroo.
there was some street work by my house last week where they were digging up an intersection to replace trolley tracks. i rolled by at midnight and watched for an hour as two big machines...driven by one guy methodically dug shit up. meanwile, i counted 17 other guys watching and chewing gum, looking bored. i dont know if they were union or not, but the whole scene was kind of funny.
i'm all for strong labor unions, but not when they get close minded, corrupt and resistant to progressive changes
horse...thats pretty impressive that you were in charge of projects like that and now youre running a record shop. no dis at all, i loev the career switcheroo.
there was some street work by my house last week where they were digging up an intersection to replace trolley tracks. i rolled by at midnight and watched for an hour as two big machines...driven by one guy methodically dug shit up. meanwile, i counted 17 other guys watching and chewing gum, looking bored. i dont know if they were union or not, but the whole scene was kind of funny.
i'm all for strong labor unions, but not when they get close minded, corrupt and resistant to progressive changes
This is not true in the USA.
Unions are so demonized in this country that any one aspiring to political office would avoid ever working for a union.
The only exception I can think of is Reagan who was once head of the Actors Guild but renounced all unions before running for public office and spent his time in office destroy unions.
The reason Joe Biden is VP (despite having low-level brain damage due to multiple strokes) is that he could deliver the union vote.
The union vote is a major force in U.S. politics, more so with the current administration than it has been in decades.
Hardly demonized.
What union job did Joe Biden ever hold?
What union official has ever held a state wide or national office?
None I know of.
If the union vote was that important certainly Obama would have picked the head of AFL or SEIU as his running mate, and not Biden.
This is not true in the USA.
Unions are so demonized in this country that any one aspiring to political office would avoid ever working for a union.
The only exception I can think of is Reagan who was once head of the Actors Guild but renounced all unions before running for public office and spent his time in office destroy unions.
The reason Joe Biden is VP (despite having low-level brain damage due to multiple strokes) is that he could deliver the union vote.
The union vote is a major force in U.S. politics, more so with the current administration than it has been in decades.
Hardly demonized.
What union job did Joe Biden ever hold?
What union official has ever held a state wide or national office?
None I know of.
If the union vote was that important certainly Obama would have picked the head of AFL or SEIU as his running mate, and not Biden.
Of course there isn't a union head running for major office.
Ever hear of conflict of interest? You would if the head of the AFL ran for office.
Besides, they wield plenty of power where they are, with WAY less public scrutiny.
One of this country's biggest travesties is what we pay our teachers.
And the Teacher's Union never has the education of children at the forefront of their agenda.
They have been ineffective in getting teachers the pay they deserve and the level of education has not improved during their watch.
Their apathy towards performance discourages many young, idealistic teachers which is sad.
I love how so many on this list are ready to chuck one of the few advantages that labor has in terms of negotiating with management. Oh my, a concentration of power can corrupt and organization, shocking!
So, the solution is to destroy unions because managers and government are free of such horrors.
The solution is the same as it is for the financial industry, regulation of such entities to minimize corruption. You will never have perfection if that is what you are looking for.
My 2 cents.
So, the solution is to destroy unions because managers and government are free of such horrors.
The solution is the same as it is for the financial industry, regulation of such entities to minimize corruption. You will never have perfection if that is what you are looking for.
My 2 cents.
First of all, I'm not sure anyone here has actually said, "let's do away with unions." At worst, we have Rock painting with a very broad brush, suggesting that union-dom, in general, is rife with corruption. I dispute that assumption but absent some better empirical evidence, I can't definitely say he's right or wrong.
As a union member, as someone with friends who are labor organizers, I think unions - in principle - are good and necessary entities. That is not to say they are - in practice - perfect or above criticism or regulation.
BUT, I'd much much much rather live in a society that is pro-union than one that is not. I can't think of a compelling argument to think otherwise unless things like worker rights are meaningless.
As a union member, as someone with friends who are labor organizers, I think unions - in principle - are good and necessary entities. That is not to say they are - in practice - perfect or above criticism or regulation.
BUT, I'd much much much rather live in a society that is pro-union than one that is not. I can't think of a compelling argument to think otherwise unless things like worker rights are meaningless.
Good article on this heah:
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-teachers3-2009may03,0,679507.story
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